tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post5452292209206354377..comments2024-03-18T19:14:18.804-04:00Comments on Daniel Greenfield / Sultan Knish Articles at DanielGreenfield.org : The Universalist HolocaustDaniel Greenfieldhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13575285186581875356noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-52174731392125169792019-01-21T16:05:38.317-05:002019-01-21T16:05:38.317-05:00Nationalists are more scientific than Unversalists...Nationalists are more scientific than Unversalists (who tend toward the mystical).Clare Sparkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13995414177104208659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-3987463268494684652013-04-16T22:51:51.759-04:002013-04-16T22:51:51.759-04:00It seems to me that the story of the Holocaust is ...It seems to me that the story of the Holocaust is skewed toward the Nationalist view...it must never happen again to US. <br />I am not anti- Israel, I think it is too easy to dismiss it and forget what gave need for a Jewish homeland.<br />I am a daughter 'of the violence' and I think on these issues of the holocaust a lot. I find this post gives a lot to me in terms of understanding. <br />It is difficult however to want to choose between the two narratives. Each has it's own necessity.<br />I hope it is OK to post a link to a few of my posts, I think of the first ( history repeat ) and the 2 on Dachau in particular as I read yours.<br />http://frombrokenstones.wordpress.com/tag/holocaust/<br />Rose Nooteboomhttp://frombrokenstones.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-33305636968800319842013-04-14T14:59:24.362-04:002013-04-14T14:59:24.362-04:00Why seek contradictions where there isn't any?...Why seek contradictions where there isn't any?<br />Indeed, Never Again!<br />and indeed, Teach Tollerance!<br />Indeed - Us, as the Jewish nation, should defend ourselves and not let this kind of eve<br />The two complete each other. They need each other for a full response to the horrible event of the holocaust.<br />Us, as the Jewish nation, will always defend ourselves and never let such a thing happen again. And us, as human beings, will make sure no society - not ours and not another one - will get to the place Nazi Germany got.<br />I think this is the common view among most Israeli Jews (like myself).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-62648304320176213202013-04-09T19:41:27.248-04:002013-04-09T19:41:27.248-04:00Anonymous
I would beg to differ on the issue of t...Anonymous<br /> I would beg to differ on the issue of the universalist teleological view.<br />History is understood by them to be circular , repeating itself till they come along and apply discipline to society to attain the dream.<br />The historic judeo-christian world view is that history is linear, that it is coming to a predetermined end. Unfortunately an apocalyptic eschatology is not as prevalent as it once was. The church is losing the war of words.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-44966099081175200832013-04-09T11:15:53.402-04:002013-04-09T11:15:53.402-04:00Sorry. The link I posted for the UC/David Horowitz...Sorry. The link I posted for the UC/David Horowitz encounter with this Muslim student should be<br /><br /><br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPjpqiCxc4o<br /><br /><br /><br />Keliata<br /><br />No doubt about it. Self-preservation and offensive measures are needed to prevent another Holocaust. None at all.<br /><br />I hope to G-d some US agency is monitoring these Muslim Student Associations. This exchange...you don't have to read between the lines at all. David Horowitz is clear as a bell.<br /><br />So is the Muslim student.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-66532801161385281372013-04-09T04:31:21.451-04:002013-04-09T04:31:21.451-04:00fsy said...
Trusting in oneself, one's fellow...<i><br />fsy said...<br /><br />Trusting in oneself, one's fellows, IDF training and leadership and being true to Zionist ideals--even unto death--makes a people very, very powerful. And if that fails, nuclear weapons work wonders. You seem to ignore this hard fact: head to head, toe to toe, yes, Israel can defeat a major power. Do you ignore this so that your argument remains relevant and true and you dont have to examine the world (and Israel) as it is? And, BTW, what major power is prepared to re-arm and attack Israel? Israels Achiles heel is falling to the death by a thousand cuts that Islam has used to defeat so many in the past. Its other weakness is are psuedo-intellectuals who live in bubbles and ignore facts. And keep this in mind: Israel keeps getting stronger economically, demographically and its millitary modernization program, started in the 70's continues relentlessly. <br /></i><br /><br />I'm not sure if you read what I wrote or just released a barrage of emotions. I don't see that I presented any 'argument' and I certainly didn't present a plan of action. I merely pointed out that there are those who question (today somewhat retroactively) the wisdom of putting our reliance in what is still a small and deeply dependent secular state.<br />fsynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-64790308808449926112013-04-08T23:58:25.446-04:002013-04-08T23:58:25.446-04:00it began splitting when the kibbutzim didit began splitting when the kibbutzim didDaniel Greenfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13575285186581875356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-13694633302505821292013-04-08T23:54:58.375-04:002013-04-08T23:54:58.375-04:00Thank you so much for this post, Daniel. I've...Thank you so much for this post, Daniel. I've been struggling with little bits of this idea for a long time. I kind of snuck up on the idea in this post (http://www.bookwormroom.com/2008/03/16/judged-not-lest-you-be-judged/ ) but couldn't quite latch on to the important point about Israel's existence being a repudiation of the "kumbayya" world view -- perhaps because I'm the child of parents who fought for Israel's independence, but was raised in the San Francisco Bay Area. I embody the schism. Bookwormhttp://bookwormroom.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-68511795305011817162013-04-08T17:07:54.203-04:002013-04-08T17:07:54.203-04:00Thank you MichaelThank you MichaelDaniel Greenfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13575285186581875356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-5328514636205353192013-04-08T16:43:35.715-04:002013-04-08T16:43:35.715-04:00Universalism vs. Nationalism have nothing to do wi...Universalism vs. Nationalism have nothing to do with what you suppose they do. <br /><br />A person could be a nationalist ideologically (which means he believes that each tribe has it's own subjective morality) but fail to recognize a threat because of disagreement over factual matters. <br /><br />Conversely a person could recognize that moral laws are universal, and yet still recognize the facts of a threat. <br /><br />Imagine a truth table, with universal vs. subjective on one axis, and recognize facts or not recognize facts on the other axis. <br /><br />The principles of justice are a subset of morality, and are true for all natural persons, in all places, and for all time. That is the true meaning of "universalism" and has nothing to do with the image you imagine. Kevinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05485671348128375796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-59524564281373958222013-04-08T16:01:58.494-04:002013-04-08T16:01:58.494-04:00Hi Daniel:
I am using this article as my Non-Coun...Hi Daniel:<br /><br />I am using this article as my Non-Council submission at the Watcher's Council.<br /><br />Mike<br />The Political CommentatorAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08420791979450335346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-27282726727787971632013-04-08T15:49:26.373-04:002013-04-08T15:49:26.373-04:00fsy said...
Trusting in oneself, one's fello...fsy said... <br /><br />Trusting in oneself, one's fellows, IDF training and leadership and being true to Zionist ideals--even unto death--makes a people very, very powerful. And if that fails, nuclear weapons work wonders. You seem to ignore this hard fact: head to head, toe to toe, yes, Israel can defeat a major power. Do you ignore this so that your argument remains relevant and true and you dont have to examine the world (and Israel) as it is? And, BTW, what major power is prepared to re-arm and attack Israel? Israels Achiles heel is falling to the death by a thousand cuts that Islam has used to defeat so many in the past. Its other weakness is are psuedo-intellectuals who live in bubbles and ignore facts. And keep this in mind: Israel keeps getting stronger economically, demographically and its millitary modernization program, started in the 70's continues relentlessly. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-30141230520402365662013-04-08T14:38:15.637-04:002013-04-08T14:38:15.637-04:00Humans can be characterized as predators and prey....Humans can be characterized as predators and prey. The Bible and Daniel point out and describe the particular predatory traits of empires (the national characteristics of people that live within those nations).<br />Israel and the US are the only two nations that have been safe havens for human prey. The US may no longer be.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-28343238155950352002013-04-08T11:09:02.976-04:002013-04-08T11:09:02.976-04:00There has been way too much tolerance lately. I p...There has been way too much tolerance lately. I practice intolerance. That doesn't mean those you disagree with need to be harmed (unless they are trying to harm you) but they need to confronted. The way tolerance is applied is that only the universalist ideas are tolerated. Call a spade a spade, call a muslim terrorist a muslim terrorist, call an illegal invader and illegal invader, and call a "soft" compliant Jew an idiot. Those who practice tolerance lose. The Nazi's didn't exterminate Jews because of the lack of tolerance training, they did it because they found it advantageous to exterminate Jews. Diversity equals perversity, tolerance equals defeat, and understanding evil equals evil.IgorRhttp://www.gmail.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-38101183865125747222013-04-08T11:06:05.913-04:002013-04-08T11:06:05.913-04:00Going along to get along only results in the "...Going along to get along only results in the "go alongers" being destroyed for lack of sticking to their principles.<br />The "avoid violence at all costs" crowd have forgotten the ultimate cost of complete pacifism in the face of evil.<br /><br />"On the efficacy of passive resistance in the face of the collectivist beast. . .<br />Had the Japanese got as far as India, Gandhi's theories of "passive resistance" would have floated down the Ganges River with his bayoneted, beheaded carcass." -- Mike Vanderboegh.<br /><br />There is NO virtue in self-sacrifice, particularly on the altar of political correctness.Carl Stevensonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08290411278408539607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-44835817444311952982013-04-08T11:02:05.692-04:002013-04-08T11:02:05.692-04:00"Jabotinsky had warned that it was coming&quo..."Jabotinsky had warned that it was coming"<br /><br />So do people like David Horowitz. I know this video is from 2010 but I just came across this and the way this UC student says "for it" is chilling.<br /><br /><br />"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPjpqiCxc4o&lc=R74aLKidNk3lMQcyxSKDGnwaPMDQqR6ZtZByN8hkKEg<br /><br />Self preservation and defense or should it be offense, are the only options.<br /><br />KeliataAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-210632855052008552013-04-08T10:04:33.799-04:002013-04-08T10:04:33.799-04:00The Universalists have clearly gotten away with th...The Universalists have clearly gotten away with this in American History as well. They look at recent years of action in the Middle East and use it to blame the US for the fact that Islam hates us.<br /><br />They have completely wiped from history not one, but two wars of vital imporance. Ask any AP High School student, and you would be luck y to find 1 out of 10 that have ever even heard about the Barbary Wars. The First Wars our nation was forced to fight after winning our independence. When then Ambassador Thomas Jefferson asked the Dey Ambassador of Tripoli why they attack American ships, Ambassador Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja had answered that Islam "was founded on the Laws of their Prophet, that it was written in their Quran, that all nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as Prisoners, and that every Musselman (Muslim) who should be slain in Battle was sure to go to Paradise."<br /><br /><br />Knowing history shows that like the Shoah, 9/11 was just one link in a very long chain. AGnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-9871027828680219542013-04-08T09:36:08.620-04:002013-04-08T09:36:08.620-04:00That the "Universalist" ideal is a pipe ...That the "Universalist" ideal is a pipe dream is easy to demonstrate. If they were correct, the world would have learned from the Shoah. The killing feilds of Cambodia, slaughter in Rawanda, gasing of Kurds in Iraq, all give lie to the Universalist message. Indeed, the Kurds are a clear example of what happens to a people without a nation of their own. Am Yisrael Chai!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-33754661078801303832013-04-08T04:59:52.169-04:002013-04-08T04:59:52.169-04:00The issue you describe is symptomatic of a cultura...The issue you describe is symptomatic of a cultural disease, a syphllis of the soul, that afflicts Western culture. It springs from the concept of history as being teleological, in that it is moving towards a preassigned goal, the perfection of eternity. This concept permeates western culture, and as such it breaks an earlier measure that tied history to the cycle of the seasons, or to the span of a human life. <br /><br />It is delusional because it has made the ideal the enemy of the good. What you decry as a Jewish phenomenon is broader in scope and profoundly more deadly in its implications. It is a 'Christian heresy' that denies Christ as a redeemer, and the concept of the soul. We should not forget that the persecution of Christian believers parallels the Jewish pogroms, and continues to this day in the sustained effort to drive Christian thought and practice from both the public sphere.<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-62093183066794763962013-04-08T04:22:41.519-04:002013-04-08T04:22:41.519-04:00There is a third group: The rational skeptics of Z...There is a third group: The rational skeptics of Zionism (as opposed to the leftist and extreme religious ideological ones) said and still say that a tiny state of our own, still highly dependent on the favor of one superpower, will never be a match for any large anti-Semitic nation. The headlines in the Israeli newspapers about "Never Again" are so ludicrous. Could Israel, however well-armed, have defeated Nazi Germany?<br /><br />Of course Universalism is a fantasy, but so is trust in a secular state.<br /><br />Ephraim from Yerushalayim (who sometimes manages to catch a little sleep.)fsynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11368628.post-19933893403940862362013-04-08T03:46:18.463-04:002013-04-08T03:46:18.463-04:00Daniel,
Both the Left and the Islamists agree Isr...Daniel,<br /><br />Both the Left and the Islamists agree Israel needs to go because it stands in the way of the brotherhood of man.<br /><br />Where they disagree is over who should this brotherhood. The Jews are a foil that denies them what they both aspire to.<br /><br />All utopias in human history have been built on Jewish blood. Jews instinctively understand this all too well and they quietly refuse the role those who run the universal brotherhood have assigned to them.<br /><br />The brotherhood of mankind is not waiting around the corner to be born. Israel's very existence is a repudiation of the notion that dissolving the particularities that constitute the essence of mankind will in the end unite it.<br /><br />On the contrary, its the particularities of mankind, embodied in Zionism and in the existence of the Jewish State that are the basis of its true salvation.NormanFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03365459073293643108noreply@blogger.com